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Audiovisual Cultures episode 44 – Performance Art Against Violence with Elvira Santamaría automated transcript


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hello and welcome to audio visual cultures a podcast that examines aspects of signed an image based cultural production and its implications and wider issues around it I'm Paula Blair and the host and creator and I'm very pleased to be joining you this time from Belfast my home city I've come over for a bit of the visit and I'm recording this short introduction during a while Kerry that rather lovely botanic gardens and so I spell fast I'm very close to the awesome museum for a bite to mates as their assent the Maria Torres she is an international nines performance artist and action artist will hopefully have a really fascinating chat about her work that you'll get a lottery does justice saying it really big thank you to everybody who Spain sharing and liking and engaging on social media it's a really huge help sabi ko CA and thanks as well to our regular supporters on Patreon there aren't many if you put the ones you have are so appreciative of what each day to find out how to support us financially and how to support by sharing and social media stick with us at the end and I'll be back with information about that person I I really hope you enjoy this conversation with my name is Sylvia Santa Maria I'm originally from Mexico I'm a performance artist I now based in Northern Ireland in Belfast I have been based here for almost ten years between Mexico and Belfast I must say that I travel a lot because my work performance our demands on performance there are other terms I think could be maybe just unpack some of the terms that we can apply because C. D. pro sass arts and a range of different approaches like performance installation and action art how do you feel about the sorts of labels on your work what do you feel it is see J. in Spanish I use the term October action out of the action on the generic for dot con to call her performance art durational performance process are osis gesture starting to gestures to combine with photography order performance installation I told you and maybe something else I'd like to label what time do we because that tells me not to classify the No Way or organize only certain ways to perform but it kills me to reflect what time what is doing it for four months what are the elements data for performance art in how are you really working on that for example time would correspond to rational performance if I'm interested in the process how one working with time that is very important to focus on that and also to save people this is about time so I said I'm going to do our process our process peace means that I'm not aiming a resort but to go into a process that people connect with on this end to intervene the proposal of the materials the space and certain principles of I'm going to apply we take us somewhere in a journey in that process for the support and even called a chamber performance our performance that happened in a close call she space give me the chance to deliver some people focused on that without any disturbance maybe I can arrange in a wake up lights to make something special like it maybe in the Asian chambers chambers C. new Grange you know there are places something this special hop in there and we need to place for example that is the need for me to label but these are more of a work of conceptual work in my in performance art or action thank that point if I indication then you work and site but there's a lot of our site as well a lot of site specific where I'm just thinking about it any work you've done in Mexico and I've seen images of and there you may be dating last things like violent or traumatic memory you know I've seen images with the with the channels and your toes and the objects that you'll find in claims and the actual landscaping things what do you feel are the differences are in the different materials with the spaces that you're working with it whether it's between an indoor event or something like that that's an option for me is very important to consider a space or even fifty tuition costs part of the larger war or even an element that will be fine what to do materials as well I used to say that I don't use I don't materials I dialogue with them I really am not using any I don't think I don't know what the space I don't know what the situation and I dealt with the materials that cost to be really a concentration focus there that we can be part of like the famous they we can collaborate with me I if I don't need your vote to eliminate them that is based for example on this the streets and to I have to consider that to be a part of that if a person is only because I'm in the public space and have to deal with that part of the not a problem that comes in the store I would never consider dot on it to come the firm of architects the allies he Katie in the reality social physical political reality in that context tweet anything so we have to be prepared for yeah really stating that we have to be awake in the moment to take on all this and just thinking about you saying collaborating with the winds I think probably one of the first actions I ever saw he was on Helen's bay at the base something with I think it's been liner by the plastic banks are you know when hi I'm making huge string of I'm so there's these beautiful shapes Manson across quite make area spans with the by do you have a name %HESITATION what do you think it is in general when they do these kind of works I don't have any title actually did try to come up to I kind of took the country deal for me but for my company I don't know what will happen in for me the title of puppies a performance or even to conserve told the station customer come up before I'm dealing with the reality that I don't know that because I have experience I could visualize something but you never know and I know that's a performance artist because the prices kind of company and even with very simple things like the plastic white box I said okay this is three may be able to afford in the night twenty two with many many I didn't know how it's going to take a look at that and then I remember rob myself you don't die didn't all these plastic possible when my body was also part of this process that they didn't know that I wanted to do so it's quite late today so the captain and I make might make my notes and reflected sometimes I found poetry that is correct so the title or the name even the concept of the station deeper way state because I have always had previous idea permissible to do have always finding the show lady but afterwards because most of the production I thought some of the Titans it's a nice idea that idea of collaborating with the elements arranging because you're harnessing it but then you being close to asylum in Europe but against yourself or you're just finding a way of visualizing the wind away almost do you find the right to come something your work quite a bit the eighty three two or repetitive actions other things that you need to work through for no for our work in different ways it's interesting for me because I can tell you I've never seen this before yeah sure and we know that always really never the same but I'm not really interested to get this talking please yeah I'm really interested to explore again and again with some of the material the space over my phone number to the station when I once and even if people like it if I didn't like it was not on the way to discover something new or even just to do with the way I want I go again and repeat the idea for me to %HESITATION when I step to the performance in nineteen ninety two tweet I really made a kind of rituals really we kind of believe it really performance of sometimes with my lord I have a Norse there to take my blood tonight make with that tweet hold to watch the storm can I make a transfusion of my block to the store calling eight I think I called that performance no nation for that you can use like fire force anyway the doors I kind of chamber performance but better to only stick with many elements the only element we told that the west not to repeat it to you to repeat but yes many elements Qatar sees not told is a ghost which to cut taxes but to storm performances in the beginning of my practice what really good tactic people cry and I didn't the card to myself like that but that in no way the bees make people enter in a story forty nine number to leave in a story that the narrative that triggered something in them but to also give them a space in a place to deal with emotions sometimes if you don't understand what what I was doing but to hold when you do decide I cry because I went to the store anyway sometimes I do something like a kind of ritual for example the last performance I have children dead weight was smoke portrait I smoke a trust the last of my face seems like I'm burning my face but just the glass enough to turn the glass is covered with the smoke in my face disappear and I'm dressing in black and I'm four and then they do something like drawing back to smoking make a drawing on my face on the smoke inductees in the meantime we be done several times only performance the door was with variations introduction or a DM depending in the place in the culture with the people I am is not the same when I do we do in Latin America Mexico when I it's not the same but I D. N. the big element that people seem to want to I want to bring them burning smoking the glass have you noticed any other differences in hi spectators react between Latin America and Europe or UK or Arden's and terms is it cathartic in fact some of the aspects of it do you find that it's different emotionally or does it depends what kind of thing that you do yes can be very different from one culture to another depends query takes place if I do the street actions usually mural people tried to ignore it because many think Scott people don't want to be part of a joke Suffolk County Kameron I didn't this time Mexico for example in Mexico and Latin America in general people in the small room willing to assist you they didn't have a problem with it usually they are going to do that you'll have a problem he's ordered to ask you what is going on or they take time to stand in front of the jewel in the center of your to be read out what you are doing and it's not the OSC in Dayton literally I mean to run because people want to talk about and I like that because I kind of stopped to talk about when I speak with people I'm not talk about all these performance on to my lord no I'm talking about people what is the concern of people that they have seen in my password in Europe is difficult in Northern Ireland people come to that the two people can be very tough officer Blane performing my life and I'm learning approach in public space but he told the people depict the culture of the city sometimes the point of a person passing by in doing something the artwork could change completely upside down and I have to be prepared to embrace it and continue with that change the issue of contingency is a really quickly one and performance art invites Martin general where you see artists are the most wonderful person in the room or the area whatever it might be because anything could happen and I think most audience members we tend to stand back and think there's a natural barrier that forms probably because we are fairly cherry and spice cinnamon cedar to not step over us wrestles you can comment for everything and you don't know if you're doing something I decide whether somebody's going to come up in a call she or demand to know what you're saying or whatever it's really fascinating to think about cultural differences from place to place where you might be doing that because you're internationally performing all over the world the T. or so I'm very conscious about would do or say to please recent history and help people close to close and sell the motion to vote for the motion on the part there there was a bunch of sometimes the mechanisms of resilience mechanisms in ourselves too close for many things portability so violence aggression and you can see their doctors performance Oct is a notion my purpose or my aim is not to make myself vulnerable even if I become a notable because I go to a public space for example can I do something that is out there your phone calls and that is a provocation wanted or not it's a privilege log to I'm interested to learn it do not force them to be very conscious what do you want to do that what do you want to be at the front of the to be you want to give something to people something for sixty think about something negative %HESITATION just self assessment data always is good to get the results you want and then okay now I want to do this because I want to tell this to the P. ten something like a one people for example something that maybe should have them connected in order to the city that is very strange like in a dream what happened to me and then maybe he does and then one of these options might be part of his life like a dream to work something out something in the deeper or any different levels maybe being forgotten it's quite we need to know very well already tensions in public or in close indoor spaces because I'm not sure really it really is powerful thank another person tweeted I did talk about any exhibitions you've been part of his wild because there are times when you're not necessarily working life for your working life as part of this may be a collective exhibition or something like that and there was one last year and I didn't get to see it unfortunately but you were part of the points arts festival just a few months ago we check to tell us a bit about that yes I was invited by the human don't know debt to be cold Connery with another four artiste female artist to make this exhibition what sort do make exhibitions but he knew that we had some remarks that might be interested to see a site or performances I present to that came out to a follow up persist please that they made enough Salvador so I wouldn't dare to a village that ten seventy one a big muscle car thousand people children women and old people were massacred by the Salvadoran are they wanted to call today resources in the sympathies in a radical way to the curriculum and the massacre many many people and I want to go with them let's see what happens after so many years colorless the please help people cultivate their memory hold the memory of help people leave after that because they're still alive people so when they're in I was speaking with people some crucial for David please I mean all the people living there had lost a member of the committee in documents in my process I want to walk to the healers people describing you know here the girls of the village were taken and raped and then more of the same wasn't very very strong so was so strong and so hopeful that in one moment I asked myself how do he and B. anyway some of the stories that way and then I'm going to focus now in this short sure wait in the gallery these are a settlement on how to approach is there these are proces it was just there looking at that very very rare it was very busy because he's really like which is the quality of the soil but anyway it makes total sense the next step to discover these because people and then a person from the village told me maybe there are many the army said there are shopped on the village no wonder everyone to just the food to be destroyed this call for those so was horrible what's that mean island's western made I used I stopped him I didn't want to do anything on March because I felt overwhelmed by that and then they start just to I don't want to safely but in no way to explore explore the quality physical quality and I reached out the image putting these past conflicts between my toes and then I said this is the steps of memory I told you before that the Titans come after hours many hours I was three days many hours only for that picture and I said and then I published in my website sure so that and he told me I wanted that is the way to continue to be a part of an exhibition for cities even discover any image through a process or sometimes a couple ideas maybe I need one of these buttons it's going to show me something for many times these different articles and then I said this is the picture but anytime there's some conformity that supports in a kind of investigation I mean much of the day delivered a summer photography or even up the deal if you haven't done much the title of the exhibition was I stepped outside and she stepped in again yes it's really fascinating title and then just what's come out of that one image no be say that was an amongst other works by other women artists but that idea so I stepped out and she stepped in again I'm thinking about eight different steps that you're maybe re treading but you're walking amongst where people had been before Ford violent things that happened before it's a really wonderful title that fits you come up with that title was huge because he wanted us to perform in maybe create a dynamic performed together and create a dynamic where we come in we need collaborate by taking the place of the order maybe the materials and three troll %HESITATION Israeli Spanish writer on women's issues including back the action to maybe just Peter over performance all performance in become really gauge collaboration that's why he decided when he told me and they even took photos over his performance would be part of that in nineteen really emerging in a kind of Oregon these elements of the older participants I was really rooting for me and very interesting to develop these dynamics suggested or proposed by him I was wondering is will affect the use of body performance argument that's your primary to really as the body but this one does body come up or do you think it comes up as the same very much in your work or is it parts of the body because I mean what if just talks but there is centered radio on your face my feet are doing and where they are and what they're engaging with you know or and other works is seen you do it you're putting something together with your fans wondered what you thought about that to you how much your body comes in what is the ideal body or their relation to deal with B. the parliament or so given that we are for some performance artist especially jumper from one side to the domino in the sectional very often %HESITATION moment in our lives I'm very concerned about so they go to the polls the naked body or difficult to explore our or expecting any closer to the house in relation with that sexual or gender equality I was never interested in that I was never had this concern the day was considered in depressants Dodge journey for stability to be president the president is more complex the presence of body odour mental faculties believes no also because you'll be late with your your body my word my body is my presence in my presence I want to bring with this residence reveals something can be on a hunt can be to hit could be the whole body I used to dress in black to neutral is a little bit in the meeting but cannot because of the lack of custom made but anyway do not put all the content that I don't want people to focus and then explore and explore the reality of the site I found that my body will perform I wanted to make the I went to benefit to local deadlines I didn't want it to stay which is I mean you know Salvador I felt so so bad yeah and I felt that that was such a kind of sacred line of people to die innocent people and I do want to stay yes Sir six quite when or then I discovered that happens like that usually my performance or could I have a clear idea of what they want to engage my body the way neat but for me it is all right I think are you more likely since the mind body yes not only me but my place to get the police report I don't want to be by did make these two companies in this one this one is the way to be a person that is more than the body but we don't that body I cannot be if it's all right then three thank you bye your collaborations and your work is part of the collective be beyond based in Belfast maybe some of the events connected right manager involvements you on your own in your own right sure and international artists and you perform follow and everywhere else and have collaborated twice many different artists as well but hi does not compare with being part of a member of a collective and how important is being part of a collective and what you do as well four means he's fun tastic that to be beyond axes a subgroup that diversifies at the same time in a collective collaborative group to perform and also in the group that organized and tried to promote performance there's different aspects BBM and sometimes for me so I need to the morning one or another sometimes I need to promote events some ideas that I have in in I collaborate with the committee notice from others to enjoy because I enjoy very much when I perform in this way black market he is one of the few collective soul groups the company's two lasting D. for performance for me but the social collective organized a couple yes to promote but also defended the art because easy to establish performance not only in the art scene and then the country bought in dialogue with the people they're always there something wrong oversees the store being close to someone that is part of existence I think it's part of racing questions through in the particular way to collaborate with them easy to resting spot sometimes I don't find any connection with them there's I don't find that they've really collaborate they repeat and repeat and repeat very much the same there's not really risking then I got part a little bit I am but I support it so we need to collaborate you don't and I'm going to just call me when I find a good idea to collaborate for me there's not collaboration if you choose to be to get them to do the same for me this is not collaboration collaboration is a dialogue in these are the date I debate in action that kind of report I've read really the margins of reflections in poetic that the business section talks about repeating monthly meetings maybe doesn't allow us to read actually now that I don't know if you decide to rescind that we don't have the time to reflect well we have we need to propose into work how to come together in different ways what do we need to debate not only in that to reflect about what we are doing in other teams around the practice I suppose and if it's okay can I ask you about your experience of being in Northern Ireland you know what's that like for you as an artist trying to work here in Maine he said earlier this is been the most challenging probably place for you to perform the check on my lamontagne times you know I've spent a lot of time when I was living here going to the baby on this month place and being quite peripheral to those things you for a while I think it was almost my own spoken job to be the person who media's it's with the general public and people would be up at free excited by what was going on and so I was the person say their artists you know they're just playing there just having playtime attention you can join in a few months you know and you get talking to drug addicts or alcoholics that we're sitting rounded writer square or families on the beach and that sort of stuff I was quite fun for a bit but yes it must be I think because here and it's okay for me to say this you never know when it could tip over into violence there's always a hint of a threat there so is wondering how they how do you feel how does it affect you being here which is in general Northern Ireland has been difficult for me it is a very different culture no the Mexican language I thought that date I mean the list within the but if they told you before this interview I'm kind of dyslexic that when I need to speak another language and my in the last maybe two years it took a little bit with the peak in March in the war so that you see what is the weight what is good for that but it has been very difficult the language especially the information with the performance only in public spaces when I do something in the same sort of space accent but I'm very interested to explore on my own and I can donate the public the space in really enter into a dialogue with people and if I get that that would be a big achievement for me have a big achievement in you for something solo and Kamera so I can buy some witnesses and maybe a camera connecting couple but from far away and let the action speaks for itself and see if I can connect with people of people even if they don't like it I can make a dialogue with them engage with you know they go with them it reflects that this is my name but for me to be a great country another thing that jokes because just on all the general it is very important because it is part of the eighty group or a social construction group but I also like once I realized that I the store to the context six people mostly that I don't know what Nigel cracks I explain joke is is what anyway because the two ladies with identity and identity has to be with the authors and the authors important this could have been made one tree speaking this country like China the weather the weather or see something else I need some but I did maybe you don't like like before but they could see their myself with a good performance artist would make problems in action yeah I mean that I learned how to feed myself please continue to leave the country how to make the best what I have and then I I do like rainy days but that's because time to before and read and write it's waking them up from they're working retain muscle awhile ago I'm just trying to think back because this is probably a few years ago nine a lot of the places you were doing was sold I'm worried in case of mixing it was Brian as well because I I know that what she did when you were lying on the crimes and the soul was on a black sheet or piece of paper or something but ever since I can remember anyone that was an umbrella yeah so that will miss in Germany which has been using salt is immaterial I use for in the same way I have the two all the time to come from the only two time off to work this one in Canada in two thousand seven I made up Rosi's there three days four hours per day with a couple different elements and I'm all those I was when I start to blow Seoul nice way to shape to draw some something you there was a accident on the floor that makes something and just for me to do that in the that day do you have for a while indeed my lord king other concerns about makes you call that like to know about the situation come try G. I put in this short to express something about the former got the idea to draw down makes the kind for a long time and that took me down to Mexico Oaxaca in the contemporary art museum in Oaxaca forty days eight hours per day I started with for mountains he also talked to the middle share and that was great was when the camera filming it was an exhibition at the same time you enter a room one got into two rooms the first thing you find out who she each each time and then continue to the next room and I'm I didn't see that coming this is very high you see only me working there and then when you go to see them up because there's less is more please for forty three days she makes I don't I have to make these these Mexico what kind of what we did tonight any of these G. G. we have a big disadvantage of Mexico and I agreed from that time even the drug dealers that's to do with these two countries so I want to develop that is why I made to September last September the second part of this project and they need to go to the United States to freeze I kind of decided have some chances I hope so I'm not thinking about it yes but also the joker fan of these places and geopolitics as well that must come straight whether even if it's not explicit but it must be an implicit same coming straight weather here and Mexico Canada and the states anywhere else in America or here in Northern Ireland to miss Mary Anne I guess you mean has anything been coming up with by borders and borderlands something that I need to find ways to get into it maybe they don't have to go posted June or in England maybe which the two went to concrete to %HESITATION to finish this idea these three countries and I have to be very interesting responses from both pieces Dr command tonight this call for dialogue and what that common sense not to send people to drive to the east coast to debate I was thinking because it's such a huge confidence he feel like comment that it's so far away from Mexico but really you're quite close neighbors in terms of there's this one country between you but actually that joined together in this he comes in and the miles so what were the responses like in Canada when it was shaping that tomorrow blowing it up by blowing it's not like your pain and try to make the proportion you know when you start to having office space to shape also United States in a little bit of Mexico but the main west kind of many people most interested in the meaning of what and I think it was interesting for them because it was you know he said the first question first question that salt mine but so many people was thinking what is the meaning of this concern you know thinking to talk them through their superstitions to I'm leaving meaning so we just have to perform that Mexico they all it does I think people that think that they don't believe in such things I would like what they want to like themselves to call them to make sure we have connected with the means we learn the number five our own and and then people just have to be concerned two courses also with salt but then there's other stores that I come to you short for example was used by the Romans cartage rebuilt I guess the Roman Empire in the Roman Empire defeated them they went to college and they must occur to people and they I didn't always short field landing fields to avoid to grow anything in many many years really but not to the concept that thank you to the store the people there all the all the people that were on but what's an effect on the and I thought it was the leading lady if your economy politics kind of countries in the country the launch of the countries in the last week yes yes that I could see the doctor to see these these economic twenty not to start Mexico to form in the crisis finish I called now with the new government talk to the call to solve many problems posted Oct the staff this is huge the problem is too big too big to be sold in six months but yeah I pointed I mean the legacies of colonialism on where another anywhere say that country if something is taken away from them your crafts or something and generations go by and the countries that originated thought to them saying Friday that love them and pay the people dying and don't align migration well actually it was your ancestors did it to them in the first place that's why all these problems arose and there's no then culpability there's no responsibility so maybe it's reminding people of that as well at school are white people and sensors because kind of problems in the heart we need to go to history memories we need to reflect what happened before they call me many of the economy they're not interested in politics all right right eight the right side of the duties individual concerns do you it is good to based on the biography we dialed the number you'll receive an introspective but I don't know if you ask me in my right he's really optimizing industry making more individualistic society one thing about this and last year or two years ago goodness it wasn't twenty seventeen in public you propose dot just a simple soon but that project to tell some fourteen and then I couldn't be here but the development assistant position and I think it was great we had the chance to see officials about performing in in what he but for many people we had some potential ideas ideals we are doing in the for example just before about speaking with people was watching outside yeah I think otherwise and we're really not committed to dialogue with people I think the schools these about these and other issues in from the west wind the only thing that the top very few people that is my only the rest was well organized and we need to continue that dialogue I have very fond memories of the site just happens to be in Belfast the way that it was happening and attended it huge monthly meeting that coincided with it people around that was not just the Vegas that file faster Northern Ireland ever seen but it may have been the biggest collective's performance action ten year effort because there were so many people there I scrambled around in chalk on thurs is right on the grind what people were doing in the you know so that was amazing but also what made it ready for me was that there was also this was an custom size square and both fast and I think it was said by gang or remote but I can clover something had also made that their meeting point at the same time for Hugh charting they were having so these chi quite massive sayings descended on this on the square in the city centre at the same time and we're perplexed by each other and it was incredible it was just something amazing and so the idea coming back operating with whatever syringae they couldn't help you find the same space I have to just exist side by side for but to truly do you try to go by we occupy we didn't give them much space to their he had to leave but anyway that was the potential for a please take therefore may be called for commenting laughing and all that one was okay not to any conflict there but didn't get it was fun moment that will keep me busy I the people to to come together usually he's here when a person decides to join or even the twenty five it was a bit difficult but I wrote feel free to join and talk in the growing nobody nobody second no because I had decided to be silent but it just right I was just describing everything that was not nice is right and she keeps saying you know I don't know what Chris still staying or Sandra striking a plan to really you know stuff like that just trying to make a pass on the insulation it was overwhelming how many people it was incredible more people in the state just to see what company it was classified it was quite remember it was unseasonably warm April day and there was I remember a woman sunbathing and she was there the whole time and she was still there when she made my cleaned up and she was still there two hours later when I went for the ball set so there were people he hung around and asked what was going on and some of the side of the side and just tried to explain it but hi could you explain welcome I think just curiosity and I can not coming from a place of either failing or demanding stress but just what's going on here all these people and when you explain to them what was happening this song okay well I'm here so this is what's happening then so it was kind of accepting expose it was a kind of critical mass that the depressed people to say okay there's a movement and Sir anything you would like to talk quickly detected Silas suburbia but something you're going to be working on %HESITATION ideas she got fifteen years working now in the project that calls for machines I plan to keep workshops which I call laboratories for people to they do reflect how he sees many things hello I'm not sure my gesture practice discipline whatever you want to do my instructor might help if you need an accountant or some kind the two point three wait to see yourself more positively when you achieve something in action in this position because I'm going to do it in Mexico I'm really committed to going to laboratories shops in different communities just trying to help this regarding the violence hi top in his company and his company HM my practice and also in the middle of some process that some patients to perform with black market it is still on in other exhortations to perform so is the best place to keep up to date with what you're doing with that P. on your website to publish some information on the place some place to perform and what is coming and I wanted to talk more of it although this is a project that I'm organizing with brand partners in this part of the IBM project this year in these human this process a performance artist I'd work is going to happen the week of the international women's day I proposed this project to be beyond the question all the members of the emergency more than seventy two hours and then we don't have something to just to focus and see what is the practice of mobile for most artistes in addressing the issues to the school so all that said that that week the technician and the second part would come may for twelve that's a nice thing often been talking for over an hour so thank you so much reading really wonderful thing the audio visual cultures with me call up there and my special guest appearance on the media this episode was recorded and Belfast and edited by all of their music keeping hearing aids the common grind by air shown basis under a creative Commons attribution three point zero and Stein noted both from CC mixer dot org if you are in doing what we're doing and you find it useful and interesting and you want to help us keep making more and to keep improving with every episodes please please please support to fire patrie on dot com forward slash AP cultures it's quite easy although it's in U. S. dollars if you're in the UK days quite easy it does all the changes for you and I just from as little as one dollar a month get you quite a lot of extra goodies in addition to the free app to suit every other week you can also support with one off donations of any amount of your choice by at PayPal dot me forward slash P. A. B. L. A. I. R. if you would like to keep in touch with us and be part of the conversation we're AT cultures on both Twitter and Facebook and you can have a look at the website for more information about everything that we're doing on audio visual cultures DOT wordpress dot com if you feel like you want to record something yourself and have it as part of our umbrella of the audio visual cultures general projects then give us a show is well let's see what we can date for nice thanks so much for listening and please keep supporting in putting everything ages so much appreciated thanks and catch you next time

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